JUANA SUMMERS, HOST:
Each week, a guest draws a card from NPR's Wild Card deck and answers a big question about their life. John Dickerson made a name for himself as an anchor at CBS News. Last year, he left the world of broadcast news to forge his own independent path in the world of journalism. He spoke with Wild Card host Rachel Martin at the Aspen Ideas Festival.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR CONTENT)
RACHEL MARTIN: How often do you think about death? Just going right for it.
JOHN DICKERSON: I mean, this bracelet I have on my wrist is a memento mori, and essentially it means, remember that you will die.
MARTIN: Is that right?
DICKERSON: So a lot.
MARTIN: So a lot?
DICKERSON: The gladiators - their slaves used to whisper that in their ears so they wouldn't - you know, so that they would be humble and not get too full of themselves. It's another Catholic thing. The - anyway, so, yeah, I think about it a lot.
MARTIN: And what is the utility of that?
DICKERSON: So for me, the reason I see grace in a lot of things is because I think pretty often about the finite nature of our lives. And therefore, when you really - when you really get going, you can see the beauty and joy and wonder of all of these people, you know? And all of the stories that you get people to tell are right at the heart of this - right? - are what is inside of us. And those stories land when you think, like, this is another human being and I am a human being. It just brings, like, everything right down to the most elemental human level...
MARTIN: Yeah.
DICKERSON: ...Which it - and it puts you on guard for joy and beauty and gratitude.
MARTIN: Yeah, yeah.
DICKERSON: And you're just, like, on the balls of your feet.
MARTIN: Yeah.
DICKERSON: Then I think, also, in our business, you know, there's a lot of stuff. There's an entire industry there to make you fixate on things that are, in the light of eternity, absolutely meaningless.
MARTIN: All right.
DICKERSON: And so that - it also helps with perspective. So you spend less time on the things that your own anxieties will keep you thinking about and more time on the grace and beauty of, you know, other humans and the world you're in.
MARTIN: I love the idea of being on the hunt for joy. Do you know Kate Bowler?
DICKERSON: Oh, yeah.
MARTIN: Does anyone know Kate Bowler?
DICKERSON: There's somebody on the hunt for joy, yes. And in part because of her...
MARTIN: The whole thing.
DICKERSON: ...You know...
MARTIN: Yeah.
DICKERSON: ...Her illness.
MARTIN: She had a terrible cancer diagnosis. But she has centered her most recent work on the pursuit of joy. And it is because she, like, lived in that line, that, like, liminal space between living and dying that she - she's now - she does not take one thing for granted, man. Like, not one thing.
DICKERSON: Yeah.
MARTIN: And it's a lovely way to live.
DICKERSON: Yeah.
SUMMERS: You can watch Rachel Martin's full conversation with John Dickerson on YouTube by searching for NPR Wild Card.
(SOUNDBITE OF LOLA YOUNG SONG, "REVOLVE AROUND YOU") Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.